Quote from xdiesp on May 15, 2011, 9:09 am

Poor puzzles: first has a white wall pretty easy to miss, otherwise the simplest; the second really, really easy. Mapper can keep working on this stuff and do wonders, but please leave the one errordeath conditions to a minimum imo...

Quote from msleeper on May 15, 2011, 7:41 pm

I'm not sure what part in your map pack this map is going to be in, but the opening excursion funnel puzzle is pretty tough and has no margin for error. You said earlier in the thread that you are going to slow it down, I'm not sure if you have done that yet or not.

I really like these puzzles that require you to angle redirection cubes upwards, but I wish maps would show this technique to the player before it's employed into a full puzzle. The Unknown did this too and I didn't realize it was the "right" solution until after some real trial and error. Teaching a concept that isn't taught to the players in the main game goes a long way to keeping confusion down.

Quote from xdiesp on May 15, 2011, 8:07 pm

Cube turning got issues though. Personally, I'm used to it from HL2 yet still got limits, like I would never force players to manage a diagonal setup of the cubes. But new players? Is it really cool to force them to turn cubes by otherwordly tricks? Maybe it's best to wait for the hydra controls refinement for that.

Quote from Thursaz on May 16, 2011, 2:34 am

But it's really easy to get it to turn up. You just need to balance the edge of the cube on any object (in this case, the little glass thing that the laser has to go through) and when you release it, it'll tip over facing up.

Quote from msleeper on May 16, 2011, 2:58 am

I'm not saying it's hard to do, I'm just saying that some players might not understand what you have to do since this technique was never done in the game.

Quote from Thursaz on May 16, 2011, 9:54 am

Oh, no, I wasn't referring to your post- I agree with you, actually. New techniques should always have 'training' chambers (then again, I do enjoy being innovative with solutions every once in a while. Regardless, I meant more of xdiesp's post, since it does seem to imply difficulty... I might have misunderstood, in retrospect.)

Quote from sorebones on May 16, 2011, 3:53 pm

But if every custom map had a cube tipping tutorial it'd get pretty annoying, wouldn't it? I don't think there's anything wrong with targeting a more experienced player.

Quote from msleeper on May 16, 2011, 4:40 pm

It takes a single room to show players "hey you can point lasers up by doing this", I don't think it's unreasonable to include that if redirecting lasers upwards is a core part of your map.

Quote from CraigChrist on May 16, 2011, 5:08 pm

I really liked the idea that you have to point the laser upwards. What I didn't like is the execution. It seemed like I'm using a bug to solve the puzzle. I know, it's stupid that the player can't just turn a cube upwards, but I would try to find more simpler way to turn it. One that doesn't depend on luck (tossing the cube and hoping it would fall right or similar).

Here's an idea: Make a panel that rotates 90 degrees when a button is pressed. So player has to put the cube on the panel and then press the button and the panel will turn the cube so it's facing upwards (that depends on how the player puts the cube on, of course but that can be nice part of the puzzle). And just use another cube to aim at that one, and you got much more user friendly puzzle. But still not that obvious (of course now it is because everyone knows that the core of the map is pointing the laser upwards )

cheers